Sticky roo pads?

clarnibass

clarnibass

Hi

I'm wondering what is everyone's opinion about the roo pads for solving sticking pads problem. I'm mostly interested to know about the black roo pads but also the white ones, both from Music Medic. I'm interested in real comparisons, such as having good non-roo pads and then changing to roo pads. Not necessarily all the pads but even just some sticky ones. Comparisons with especailly sticky (stock?) pads are not significant to me.

The reason it's interesting to me now is because the roo pads are advertised as less sticky than non-roo pads. There is no real specific information about what non-roo pad, etc. However the more I see saxophones overhauled with black roo pads the more I think they are not really less sticky. I don't have 100% objective comparisons. But when I compare overhauls I did (with the pads I like, not roo) with overhauls I see with the black roo pads, with as similar conditions as possible i.e. tone holes, area of the player, amount of playing, cleaning habbits of the player, etc. etc. the black roo pads seem only very slightly less sticky if at all.

If you found roo pads less sticky in as identical condition as possible, what pads did you have before to compare with? Maybe the white ones tend to be less sticky than the black ones, I have only seen very few of the white ones.

Thanks

Nitai
 
Nitai: Earlier this century, I bought a new Yanagisawa S992. A couple of years ago I had it overhauled and black roo-pads were installed. No "stickies" so far - the horn plays fine. Admittedly, I don't play the horn much (I favor my '28 Buescher TT straight), but whenever I take the S992 out of the case, the closed pads are not stuck shut. DAVE
 
Yes, the pads were original. Frankly, I don't recall much about the horn during its original years except that after the overhaul it plays great - better than it did when new. Not a slam on Yanagisawa horns, mind you (I've owned and still have several), just that the horn plays better then before. DAVE
 
I think Roo's are less sticky. I have them in a few horns. The leather is the same between the black and the white ones (they are just dyed). The difference between them is that the black ones have a firmer felt. I prefer the feel of the white ones.
 
Dave Dolson said:
Yes, the pads were original. Frankly, I don't recall much about the horn during its original years except that after the overhaul it plays great - better than it did when new.
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It is very rare that an instrument doesn't play better than new after a very good overhaul. Especially if the overhaul is done after some time when the player slowly forgets how well it played in the past. So if I understand you can't actually say anything about the comparison of stickiness of the original pads vs. black roo pads.

Ed Svoboda said:
I think Roo's are less sticky.
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Why do you think that? I'm just interested how you came to this opinion. What non-roo pads have you tried in same conditions that were stickier? I know people have roo pads and they are not sticky, but I know many with very good non-roo pads that are not sticky at all too, which is why I asked about more reliable comparisons.

Thanks.
 
clarnibass said:
It is very rare that an instrument doesn't play better than new after a very good overhaul. Especially if the overhaul is done after some time when the player slowly forgets how well it played in the past. So if I understand you can't actually say anything about the comparison of stickiness of the original pads vs. black roo pads.


Why do you think that? I'm just interested how you came to this opinion. What non-roo pads have you tried in same conditions that were stickier? I know people have roo pads and they are not sticky, but I know many with very good non-roo pads that are not sticky at all too, which is why I asked about more reliable comparisons.

Thanks.
Click to expand...

I have multiple horns . . . some with older regular pads, some with new regular pads, and some with roo's. When I played a lot of tenor I would switch between a few different horns. Two had roo's and one did not. The one that did not tended to have sticky pads show up on occasion while the other two did not. Both of my bari's have regular pads and within a couple of months of the overhaul I experienced a sticky pad on the g sharp on each of them. I do not have a bari with roo's as my present tech doesn't care for them as much as my previous tech.

In my experience it seems like roo's are less likely to stick. On the four horns I have with roo's (two altos and two tenors) I may have experienced one sticky pad in about four or five years. Hopefully this provides a reliable comparison. :emoji_relaxed:
 
Clarnibass, I am very interested in this thread and think there may be something to the lack of responses. I am curious, what "non-Roo" pads do you currently use and what have you used in the past...and with what results? I have not seen any hard evidence that these Roo pads stick less, but a lot of people seem to think they do. Could it be the power of advertising?

thanks,
Matt
 
Nitai: I realized when I first posted that my experience didn't meet exactly what you were asking about and I thought about it before posting. However, there had been some previous roo-pad negatives and I decided that I'd post my experience anyway, just to balance out the roo-pad discussion in this thread (assuming that some would contend that roo-pads were more sticky). Couldn't hurt.

Yes, I realize that most overhauls would result in a fairly new horn playing better than before. I'd played the S992 enough that I wanted the overhaul done and the guy who did it (Jim Scimonetti Jr.) did a terrific job. Was an overhaul absolutely necessary? Probably not, but what the hey - I can afford it. I'm glad I had it done, and I'm glad I used the black roo-pads with the smooth-domed metal resos.

Funny, though - I took the horn out yesterday and the low C# was stuck shut. No problem, though - many of my saxophones will stick the C#1 and the middle G#. I popped it open with a thumb and it did not stick the rest of the day. DAVE
 
Dave Dolson said:
...many of my saxophones will stick the C#1 and the middle G#.
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Yamaha makes this non-stick paper, comes in 50 sheets a pack with half of them divided in two, so you really get 75. Costs almost nothing and lasts forever. I use them for exactly the keys you mention and they do not stick. Sorry for the off-topic intrusion.
 
steen said:
Yamaha makes this non-stick paper, comes in 50 sheets a pack with half of them divided in two, so you really get 75. Costs almost nothing and lasts forever. I use them for exactly the keys you mention and they do not stick. Sorry for the off-topic intrusion.
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Isn't 75 a serious overkill? Shouldn't 2 be plenty?
 
Steen: I know about the Yamaha pad-papers - have a pad of them and use them when pads stick. A temporary fix, but they do work. DAVE
 
altomatt said:
Clarnibass, I am very interested in this thread and think there may be something to the lack of responses.
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... Or a lot of folks that post on this forum just don't use 'em :p.

Do remember that the "roo pads" are fairly new.
 
pete said:
... Or a lot of folks that post on this forum just don't use 'em :p.

Do remember that the "roo pads" are fairly new.
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I have white Roo on 4 saxes. None of them have any sticking issues. I do not remember what was on most of them before getting replaced. Oldest set is 6+ years, newest set is under a month.
 
Dave Dolson said:
there had been some previous roo-pad negatives and I decided that I'd post my experience anyway, just to balance out the roo-pad discussion in this thread (assuming that some would contend that roo-pads were more sticky).
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I understand, but nothing in this thread implied roo pads are more sticky than other pads. Actually nothing negative about roo pads at all. I was just asking for real comparisons of roo pads with other good pads re stickiness. My experience just shows, so far, that at least the black roo pads are not less sticky with some other pads, or at least not significantly. I found that some non-roo pads are very sticky though, but these are not the ones I'm interested to comapre with. I guess I'll wait to see what I find with more roo pads I see and also wait for more accurate comparisons, if there are any.

altomatt said:
Clarnibass, I am very interested in this thread and think there may be something to the lack of responses. I am curious, what "non-Roo" pads do you currently use and what have you used in the past...and with what results? I have not seen any hard evidence that these Roo pads stick less, but a lot of people seem to think they do. Could it be the power of advertising?
Click to expand...
The pads I normally use are made by Music Center. I use mainly one model but also use two other models sometimes. They don't seem significantly sticky to me. A lot depends on the player, the instrument, conditions (i.e. where they live), how they clean (or not) the instrument, etc. etc.

I've tried many different models of pads before I chose to stock what I do. Since then I've tried a few more. This is seperately from all the pads I see on instruments. My impression so far is that the (black) roo pads are not, or at least not significantly, less sticky than the pads I use, in the most similar conditions that I can compare them.

The main reason I'm interested is that I considered (and still considering) stocking and suggesting roo pads for keys that tend to be especially sticky sometimes (G#, Bb). This happens with the pads I use sometimes, when a player lives in a very humid area (e.g. city close to the beach) and insists never to clean their saxophone. I constantly recommend to swab the sax after playing but some players don't do it, in addition to drinking whatever they want while playing. I was hoping roo pads might be able to fight even that stickiness but as I said, the more I see them the more it seems like they wouldn't help for this i.e. I see roo pads stick in these situations.
 
clarnibass said:
I constantly recommend to swab the sax after playing but some players don't do it, in addition to drinking whatever they want while playing.
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Suits them fine. I think the consensus is not to ingest sugared liquids shortly before or during a performance, as you will inevitably spray a fine sticky mist through your instrument. If the player refuses to see that, he/she should bear the consequences and have the instrument serviced more often or live with sticky pads.
 
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I think you are "chasing your tail" trying to find a pad that will not stick under any circumstances. There are just too many variables.

Cleaning the pad and tonehole with Naptha and then using 1000 grit sandpaper face down on the tonehole with a sprinkling of Gig Dust or Teflon Powder on the back and pulling out from under the pad two or three times with light pressure on the key is the very best solution I have found.

You need to remember that I work on hundreds of student rental saxes each year and see the worst of the worst care. If that trick does not remove the stickiness, then the pad is replaced.

Until tonehole surfaces are coated with teflon and the pads are covered with the same material or silicone? we are going to have sticky saxophone pads.

John
 
I have black roos in my CB Mad Meg. I had them installed because the stock pads were poor and very sticky. When the G/ G# would stick often, it was a pain. The bell brace is right over the pad cup and almost impossible to get to in there with anything to wipe it clean. The roos fixed that issue. I can't say they're totally stick free. They're much better though.

I also had white roos put in my series III. That didn't go so well. The softer whites would not settle and make consistant contact. After three trips back to my tech, we gave up and ripped them out.

Both horns are tenors btw

TJ
 
jbtsax said:
I think you are "chasing your tail" trying to find a pad that will not stick under any circumstances. There are just too many variables.
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That would be nice, but I'm not really trying to find that. I was wondering, since the pads I use are usually not sticky in normal conditions, what advantage against stickiness would I get from roo pads?

The more I check the roo pads and read about it, I get the impression the non-stickiness of the roo pads is only against the stickiness that sometimes comes from the pads themselves. Is that correct? Some non-roo pads have this problem and some don't.
 
It think it will be hard to get a good overview of this unless all non-roo pads were sticky. Owners of horns with regular pads that are not sticky may be less likely to change to roos or switch to to other factors, such as expectation of extended longevity. And those with sticky pads may just choose roos over other non-sticky pads due to the reputation that roos have.
 
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