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Project Du Jour: Learn to Play Bass

During the late 60s and very early 70, it was really difficult getting work as a sax player around here.

Since I knew how to play bass, and had one, I got gigs as a bass player who doubled on sax and rhythm guitar. It was about 99% bass playing, which in itself is a lot of fun.

I had a Fender P bass and an Ampeg B-18 amp.

Now we are talking about a jazz-dead area. At the time, a jazz band I used to play with was working one day a week, for $24 per player. It was top 40, psychedelic album oriented rock, or country.

I got gigs playing top40 and psychedelia. I guess I could have gotten work doing country, but at the time that meant I only had to know the root and the fifth of any chord. Country has progressed since then.

Notes ♫
 
During the late 60s and very early 70, it was really difficult getting work as a sax player around here.

Since I knew how to play bass, and had one, I got gigs as a bass player who doubled on sax and rhythm guitar. It was about 99% bass playing, which in itself is a lot of fun.

I had a Fender P bass and an Ampeg B-18 amp.

Now we are talking about a jazz-dead area. At the time, a jazz band I used to play with was working one day a week, for $24 per player. It was top 40, psychedelic album oriented rock, or country.

I got gigs playing top40 and psychedelia. I guess I could have gotten work doing country, but at the time that meant I only had to know the root and the fifth of any chord. Country has progressed since then.

Notes ♫
Ok now you are showing your age. Lol
I was kid for all of ‘60’s and most of the 70’s and while I supported myself since I left home at the age of 16, I never had to support myself through playing etc Not to say I wouldn’t have wanted to. I didn’t start playing until 1973 and once I got in the bands, our gigs were taken care of. It might have been a bit different here. The disco era was evolving then so that big band sound was hugely coming back where I lived.

It’s really good that you could play bass as well as other instruments. You are multi talented for sure.

Bass is an instrument I usually listen for in songs. A good strong bass that has dynamic rhythm is heavenly.
 
I'm definitely showing my age, I'm 75 and a half!

I started gigging professionally full-time in 1964. I was in a road band then, we eventually worked our way up to becoming the opening act for the very first rock concerts (instead of dances) for the stars of the day, The Four Seasons, The Association, The Kingsmen (and others) and then opening for Motown Acts.

We were the first choice to be the first all-white band to record on the Motown family of labels. Unfortunately, Motown only wanted to pay 2 cents per record, and out of our royalties they would deduct inflated recording costs, inflated distribution costs, and inflated promotion costs.

Motown also wanted to own the publishing rights, have a Motown ghostwriter who didn't contribute anything get his/her name on the record to collect half the songwriting royalties. Our management figured we would have to sell a million LPs right off the bat to pay off the debt and become more than one-hit-wonders. They misjudged our bargaining power, stood firm at 2.5 cents per record, Motown dropped us, and hired their second choice, The Sunliners.

Motown also wanted to own the band name, so they could hire or fire anyone they wanted and put 3 or 4 groups on the road in concert at the same time under the same name. So The Sunliners became Rare Earth. That was pretty common back then, when bands had little exposure on TV, so people didn't recognize them as individuals. That all changed when the Beatles hit the scene.

<<< Rewind back to before concerts <<<

Every songwriter of the day didn't have the wisdom to put a sax part in every Top40 record. So while I was in that band the other guys taught me bass, guitar, and keyboards. I learned drums and sax when I was in school, so I already knew how to play those.

Our drummer was a good singer, so I'd play drums on a few songs, the bass player would play guitar, so I'd play bass for a few songs, sometimes rhythm guitar using the guitar players 'other' guitar and so on. We played mostly college towns before the concerts, and it was a lot of fun. I truly like switching instruments.

My first all-night bass playing came when we were hired to back up Freddy "Boom Boom" Cannon for a short series of concerts. Our bass player was good, but wasn't good at learning by ear. I was blessed with a good ear, so would often pick out the parts and show them to him. Freddy came to rehearsal, saw me doing that, and said that he wanted me to play the bass, so I played bass all night and the bass player played rhythm guitar.

>>> Fast forward >>>

After the glory days were over, I tried a couple of day jobs while playing as a weekend warrior, but neither one worked out all that well. I hated being a wage slave, I ended up in the complaint department trying to please angry customers, and the weekend warrior musicians were less than the caliber of musicians I was used to playing with, so I went back to music full-time.

I realized that even if I didn't make the 'big time', living a life by doing what I love to do as my vocation was a lot better than making more money and putting in 40 hours per week to some faceless corporation.

So I went back to self-employment, where I get to pick which 16 hours of the day I get to work, and love every minute of it.

All that instrument switching plus the theory and arrangement lessons I took in school came in very handy. In 1990 or 91 I wrote some additional styles for the auto-accompaniment app, Band-in-a-Box. I played all the pop music instruments, so I knew how they interacted with the other instruments, and their place in the arrangements, so I did it for fun. I gave the styles to my friends, and they told me they liked them better than the ones that came out in Band-in-a-Box. (Aren't friends wonderful?)

So in 1992 I took out an ad in Electronics Musician magazine and started selling aftermarket styles discs and later fake discs for BiaB. I've sold them to musicians in 100 different countries, and built a second business. It started as mail-order, and grew to Internet order. I write my own web pages too, except for the shopping cart. I chose a shopping cart with the best safety record in the business, figuring they could protect my customers better than I could.

I'm working on my 30th style e-disc and my 46th fake e-disc, plus selling BiaB products by other musicians at http://www.nortonmusic.com

<<< rewind a bit <<<

In 1985 I started a duo with the woman who is now my wife. She was in a different band when we met in the late 70s. We eventually found ourselves in a 5 piece together and when that band had personnel problems resulting in 3 months out of work in one year we started our duo. http://www.s-cats.com

I make my own backing tracks since I can play multiple instruments, and I save the most fun parts for us to play live on top of the tracks. We selected the +55-year-old market here in Florida, and until COVID hit, we were never out of work. In fact, we had to block out time for vacations in advance our we'd look at the calendar and realize we wouldn't be able to take one. We're working every week again, but only taking outdoor gigs to minimize our odds of catching the plague.

Sorry if this is a bit long-winded.

Anyway, I'm having a wonderful life making music with my wife/lover/best-friend/band-mate/BiaB-aftermarket-biz-partner. I have no intention of retiring, it's too much fun, plus, if I rest, I'll rust.

Notes ♫
 
I'm definitely showing my age, I'm 75 and a half!

I started gigging professionally full-time in 1964. I was in a road band then, we eventually worked our way up to becoming the opening act for the very first rock concerts (instead of dances) for the stars of the day, The Four Seasons, The Association, The Kingsmen (and others) and then opening for Motown Acts.

We were the first choice to be the first all-white band to record on the Motown family of labels. Unfortunately, Motown only wanted to pay 2 cents per record, and out of our royalties they would deduct inflated recording costs, inflated distribution costs, and inflated promotion costs.

Motown also wanted to own the publishing rights, have a Motown ghostwriter who didn't contribute anything get his/her name on the record to collect half the songwriting royalties. Our management figured we would have to sell a million LPs right off the bat to pay off the debt and become more than one-hit-wonders. They misjudged our bargaining power, stood firm at 2.5 cents per record, Motown dropped us, and hired their second choice, The Sunliners.

Motown also wanted to own the band name, so they could hire or fire anyone they wanted and put 3 or 4 groups on the road in concert at the same time under the same name. So The Sunliners became Rare Earth. That was pretty common back then, when bands had little exposure on TV, so people didn't recognize them as individuals. That all changed when the Beatles hit the scene.

<<< Rewind back to before concerts <<<

Every songwriter of the day didn't have the wisdom to put a sax part in every Top40 record. So while I was in that band the other guys taught me bass, guitar, and keyboards. I learned drums and sax when I was in school, so I already knew how to play those.

Our drummer was a good singer, so I'd play drums on a few songs, the bass player would play guitar, so I'd play bass for a few songs, sometimes rhythm guitar using the guitar players 'other' guitar and so on. We played mostly college towns before the concerts, and it was a lot of fun. I truly like switching instruments.

My first all-night bass playing came when we were hired to back up Freddy "Boom Boom" Cannon for a short series of concerts. Our bass player was good, but wasn't good at learning by ear. I was blessed with a good ear, so would often pick out the parts and show them to him. Freddy came to rehearsal, saw me doing that, and said that he wanted me to play the bass, so I played bass all night and the bass player played rhythm guitar.

>>> Fast forward >>>

After the glory days were over, I tried a couple of day jobs while playing as a weekend warrior, but neither one worked out all that well. I hated being a wage slave, I ended up in the complaint department trying to please angry customers, and the weekend warrior musicians were less than the caliber of musicians I was used to playing with, so I went back to music full-time.

I realized that even if I didn't make the 'big time', living a life by doing what I love to do as my vocation was a lot better than making more money and putting in 40 hours per week to some faceless corporation.

So I went back to self-employment, where I get to pick which 16 hours of the day I get to work, and love every minute of it.

All that instrument switching plus the theory and arrangement lessons I took in school came in very handy. In 1990 or 91 I wrote some additional styles for the auto-accompaniment app, Band-in-a-Box. I played all the pop music instruments, so I knew how they interacted with the other instruments, and their place in the arrangements, so I did it for fun. I gave the styles to my friends, and they told me they liked them better than the ones that came out in Band-in-a-Box. (Aren't friends wonderful?)

So in 1992 I took out an ad in Electronics Musician magazine and started selling aftermarket styles discs and later fake discs for BiaB. I've sold them to musicians in 100 different countries, and built a second business. It started as mail-order, and grew to Internet order. I write my own web pages too, except for the shopping cart. I chose a shopping cart with the best safety record in the business, figuring they could protect my customers better than I could.

I'm working on my 30th style e-disc and my 46th fake e-disc, plus selling BiaB products by other musicians at http://www.nortonmusic.com

<<< rewind a bit <<<

In 1985 I started a duo with the woman who is now my wife. She was in a different band when we met in the late 70s. We eventually found ourselves in a 5 piece together and when that band had personnel problems resulting in 3 months out of work in one year we started our duo. http://www.s-cats.com

I make my own backing tracks since I can play multiple instruments, and I save the most fun parts for us to play live on top of the tracks. We selected the +55-year-old market here in Florida, and until COVID hit, we were never out of work. In fact, we had to block out time for vacations in advance our we'd look at the calendar and realize we wouldn't be able to take one. We're working every week again, but only taking outdoor gigs to minimize our odds of catching the plague.

Sorry if this is a bit long-winded.

Anyway, I'm having a wonderful life making music with my wife/lover/best-friend/band-mate/BiaB-aftermarket-biz-partner. I have no intention of retiring, it's too much fun, plus, if I rest, I'll rust.

Notes ♫
You’ve lived a life most musicians can only dream about, however I’m not one of them.
I’ve been fortunate enough to play in some great bands and had some incredible gigs. Quite a few, but I’m NOT a social butterfly. In order to do what you are doing one has to really enjoy socializing or mingling with others and I just don’t.

I’m an introverted loner who was saved by the creativity of music. Music gave me a safe place to express myself. It gave me something positive to focus on so I didn’t drown in despair and self pity. It broadened my horizons and helped open up a part of me I didn’t know I even had.

There have been long periods of time when I haven’t played my saxophone or my keyboards but I almost always sang. In the mid 60’s, I was a wee child singing with my dad while he played the piano. Unknowingly, he taught me how to harmonize and well. He could harmonize like nobody I knew and play Chopin so well. That was the blessing beneath the chaos.

Once moving to the country, my band playing seized . Even though I had plenty of music to play, wasn’t as fulfilling. I’d get bored so I got a keyboard and started learning chords so I could create my own vocal accompaniment and it was very fulfilling but nothing compared to when I bought my soprano.

Three Christmases ago I purchased a Yamaha soprano and fell in love with the tone of it. Suddenly I discovered that I prefer playing whatever song I want in the key I want. Now I pick background music ,( usually piano but not always ) I figured out the melody and have been doing it ever since. In fact I joined a karaoke app so I could ding and create sax solos for songs I enjoy. It’s very fulfilling.

The other day I purchased a new alto saxophone and the store I purchased from ( long & mcquades ) asked if I wanted a permanent gig. I didn’t ask how much it pays because I turned it down. I’m just turning 62, and I’m truly enjoying making music for the sole purpose of my own enjoyment. It’s truly fulfilling. There’s no external pressure whatsoever; just enjoyment.

My new sax isn’t top of the line but it’s my first ever new instrument and for myself, it’s perfect for what I want.
 
Yamaha makes some nice saxophones. I bought a YTS-52 which is supposed to be an advanced student level horn for a backup, and I find I play it on the gig more than the MacSax (Taiwan) that I had custom-made for myself. It's free-blowing, the intonation is very good, and the tone is nice. I've had a lot of saxes in my day, Conn Fireworks, Selmer Modele 26, Selmer Mark VI and Mark VII, H Couf Superba, Grassi Prestige, Pan American (backup horn), and the MacSax.

I played the Grassi for some time, which isn't a top-of-the-line horn, but it served me just fine. I've seen some musicians play some student model guitars and saxes that blew me away. The make or model doesn't matter to me, only the sound.

I have a 1925 silver plated King alto with the voice of an angel, but I don't play it much anymore. I bring a Wind Synthesizer to the gig and use it to cover alto parts. I still bring the Tenor, Flute and Guitar. I quit bringing a keyboard too. It was just too much to schlep when I started doing one-nighters.

I, too, was an introvert for years, but on stage, something magical happened. On stage, I didn't have to talk to people, just play music for them. I didn't drown in despair, I was just shy and never knew what to say. Over the years, I've learned to come out of that shell. Now we have fans we have known for decades that have become our friends.

And I am living a lucky life. Like anyone, it had its ups and downs, but it's mostly up. For the past 44 years, I've been living with the girl that I would have dreamed about, if I knew how to dream that big.

I, too, sing, but for me, it wasn't natural. It was the hardest instrument I've ever learned. On most instruments, if you put your fingers in the right place, the right note comes out, not so with the voice. Fortunately, I knew about breath support from taking sax lessons when I was young, but controlling that instrument in my throat to the point where I could sing on stage took years. Mrs. Notes is a fantastic singer, I'm decent and probably will never be great due to the instrument I was born with.

My dad played music too. He played trumpet and violin before he had me, and ukulele and later organ (with bass pedals). We always had music in the house, my dad liked big band music from Artie Shaw to Spike Jones, mom liked Broadway tunes and my big sister introduced me to rock when Bill Haley and his Comets were chart busters.

I've never lived in the country. I've traveled and gigged there, but never took up residence anywhere that is too far from the ocean. I grew up near the sea, and I just feel more comfortable there. I have nothing against it, and like visiting rural areas and especially uninhabited (by humans) area, and could live there if I had to, but I like the seaside. That's good because I get a lot of gigs due to the tourist industry in Florida.

I haven't missed a gig since I went pro in 1964, and I'm going to gig as long as I can play well enough to get an audience. A pro musician is not only what I do, it's what I am.

Notes ♫
 
We couldn’t be more different.
My husband is definitely my best friend and the person I love more than anyone however, I’m so glad he has his own hobbies that he’s into. He enjoys fishing, woodworking and recently, cooking.

Years ago I bought him a guitar and while he honestly loves the instrument, he’s not all that fond of playing it. He’d rather be out in his workshop woodworking or just tinkering around. He just finished insulating it so it’s a great place for him to hang out which I love for many reasons.

We met working together on IBM computers. He was in charge of production and I was in charge of quality control and we clashed often. Lol! Currently that’s too much together time. He only just retired and I’m glad he has enough things to keep himself busy.

We do lots of things together but practising and doing gigs together to make a living wouldn’t work for us. Since he has a great paying job, we now have an awesome retirement fund which we are currently enjoying. He’s 5 years younger than me and is thoroughly enjoying early retirement.

My discomfort of others isn’t due to a lack of exposure. I’m sure if I really wanted or needed to perform, I’ve no doubt I would. I just don’t want to. I’ve got severe complex PTSD so being around too many others overwhelms me.

I’ve had a Paris made SML since 1973 and it’s the only alto I’ve ever used. I did recently get it refurbished and it plays well but I definitely love my Yamaha soprano better. It’s only a YSS475 so isn’t even a pro model but the tone still blows me away. I just love it but even tone preference is such a personal thing. Some prefer a darker raspier tone while other prefer a crisper cleaner one. Everyone is different. Besides tone, the free blowing factor wins me over big time and Yamaha offers that.

We live right by the ocean.
Here’s our view.
17E15A50-3715-4A99-932F-910C1C6B6507.jpeg
 
Yes, we've drifted off topic. Yes Keesha, we are different, but one size does not fit all. We can continue via PM if you like. BTW, the view from your home is great.

Back to you, Gandalfe.

For me, and more accompaniment rather than solo, showcase of slap bass styles, I find plucking with my fingers to be better in live situations, and a pick for recording. The fingers give a rounder tone with more bass, but the pick gives a harder attack. In recordings the 'more bass' doesn't come out as well so it's easier to hear the bass when picked.

But of course, there is more than one right way to do anything.

Notes ♫
 
Sorry Gandalfe. I just realized this is ‘your’ thread about playing the bass.
Sincere apologies.
No worries. I've learned a lot in this thread. Carry on.

Oh, and this is my greenbelt backyard. Abby (the collie) invited some neighbors over for some quality time. :)
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No worries. I've learned a lot in this thread. Carry on.

Oh, and this is my greenbelt backyard. Abby (the collie) invited some neighbors over for some quality time. :)
View attachment 10330
Awwwwww….. dogs! I LOVE dogs. That’s a fine looking Collie. Green belts are awesome. Back in Ontario we had a huge forest that was environmentally protected ( meaning none of it could be cut down ).
Now here in Nova Scotia, all the land behind us is crown land, meaning it’s owned by the government. People can actually legally camp on it if they wanted. Luckily that’s far away from our house.
 
Yes, we've drifted off topic. Yes Keesha, we are different, but one size does not fit all. We can continue via PM if you like. BTW, the view from your home is great.

Back to you, Gandalfe.

For me, and more accompaniment rather than solo, showcase of slap bass styles, I find plucking with my fingers to be better in live situations, and a pick for recording. The fingers give a rounder tone with more bass, but the pick gives a harder attack. In recordings the 'more bass' doesn't come out as well so it's easier to hear the bass when picked.

But of course, there is more than one right way to do anything.

Notes ♫
Of course it’s ok to be different. That’s one of the greatest joys.

I’d rather not carry on a private conversation. I’m not comfortable with that so if it’s ok with Gandalf I’ll continue the conversation here.

I lived in Ontario most of my life. We lived in southern Ontario, a few hours north of Toronto. Living in area we lived in came with many privileges, one of them was having access to seeing the best musical performances in the world. The amount of talent I got to chance to see is unbelievable as well as the venues played. I’ve literally seen hundreds of concerns in some of the nicest places.

Now we live in Nova Scotia right by the ocean and it’s heavenly. It certainly doesn’t have the convenience that we were accustomed to but we wanted to gear down to a simpler lifestyle. There’s only 40 residents in a span of about 30 miles which is fine with us. It’s a gorgeous area and our neighbours live far enough away that we have plenty of privacy; something we both appreciate.

My partner isn’t really musical. I bought him a beautiful Norman acoustic guitar which he loves but doesn’t play. He’s actually tone deaf but so was my mom. I’m thrilled that my man has his own hobbies and his own garage to hang out in. He’s got his hobbies which he’s really into and I’ve got mine. Personally I ‘need’ a certain amount of space. I couldn’t handle all that togetherness that you talk of and I know he feels the same way so it’s all good.

I’m not embarrassed by not having a top of the line saxophone. If I like the sound I am getting then that’s really all that matters. Im not out to impress anyone which was why it was easy to pass up on the band offer. At one time having others validate my musical talent was fairly important. Now I honestly play for me. I totally get a kick out of playing. It takes such little time to figure out what keys songs are in and a bit more time to think of a cool solo but it’s still fun and somewhat challenging.

Do you use synthetic reeds at all?
If so what type(S) did you try and what do you think of them?

Is there a casual chat section on this forum?
 
I'll add to the off topic. Dogs and waterfront views. Seven years ago my wife and I retired to East Tennessee from the Chicago suburbs. All our life we wanted to live on the water and we finally achieved our dream. It's the best decision of our lives. Here is our view over the Tennessee River at sunset.
IMG_0304 (Medium).JPG


And here are our two wonderful Golden Retrievers after hard day of swimming.

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Feel free to resume talking about playing bass.
 
Hey! Oh yeah boating! We like that too.
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Beautiful swimming spots with crystal clear water.
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We go hiking everyday.
C15D1439-96C4-4816-85C3-9F81DE0E2245.jpeg

Lots of fabulous things to photograph for painting later.
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Freshest fish ever
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And never tire of the sunsets.
21C78E84-BBE7-4E9F-92E0-F05281DBA26F.jpeg

My husband hadn’t planned on retiring but when Covid hit he was working in one of Canada’s most infected areas. Besides, he was a total workaholic. I wasn’t quite sure how he’d handle retirement but I strongly suggested it.

Within 4 months we had our house purged of stuff , sold and had purchased another for 1/2 the cost. Since we sold in a buyers market we got top $ so it was a great move.

Like yourself we couldn’t be happier including our dogs and cat. They all love retirement too. In fact, this has been our best year ever regardless of the pandemic. We never thought life could be this good.
 
I love the Canadian Maritime Provinces. It's a beautiful part of the world, and I've been from New Brunswick to Labrador, except for PEI (In 3 trips I ended up running out of time).

I tried a few different kinds of synthetic reeds and never adjusted. During COVID isolation I put what I thought was the best of the bunch on, Fibrereed Carbon and played it exclusively for about a year. Mrs. Notes and I practiced 2-3 times a week to learn new songs and keep our chops up.

I finally put on the cane reed and right away Mrs. Notes said WOW! What a difference.

It might not be the same for everyone, but a lot of my personal expression on the sax comes from changing the tone, sometimes from note to note and sometimes even during a held note. From fuzzy subtones to overblowing it to make it distort a bit to changing my oral cavity to change the vowel sound, to adjusting breath control to change the color of the sound, and so on. The synthetic reeds gave me a decent tone, but only one tone. If I overblew they gave me the same tone only louder, if I relaxed my breath support they gave me the same tone unless I relaxed too much and then they would just quit, and so on.

I think if I were in a sax section and didn't play many improvised solos, the syn-reed would be a decent choice. But as the only sax player in the band, and since my job is either solo or the response part of a call-and-response with the singer, I need all the vox humana I can get out of the horn, and the syn-reed limited that for me.

I, too, like dogs and cats, but I don't have any. Or better yet, they don't have me. I gig for a living, and sometimes that means a gig out of town. We even played Cruise Ships for 3 years back in the 1980s. A family pet requires a constant companion, and it's unfair to the animal to leave them with a pet sitter or in a kennel a few times a year.

I like boating, and had a 23' sloop at one time, but after enjoying it for about 10 years, I sold it. It had gotten to the point where I was spending more time on upkeep than sailing it.

I don't fish much anymore, along with the population explosion of South Florida, the fishing got worse and worse. I don't have the patience for the long waits required now. I have a neighbor who fishes a lot, so I get a lot of fresh fish.

Mrs. Notes and I have two main passions, Travel and Music.

I chose travel first because it's shorter. Every year before COVID we went somewhere. 49 US states a lot of Canada and down to Costa Rica, a number of Caribbean Islands, Europe from the UK to Hungary (east to west) and as far as Spain and Italy in the south. Northern Africa, China, and Australia too. Before COVID we were planning a trip to Madagascar.

For the rest of the year we do music. My wife is a world-class singer, and she plays guitar and synth. I'm a decent singer and a multi-instrumentalist In our duo http://www.s-cats.com I play mostly sax, wind synthesizer, and guitar. I also make our backing tracks and do the drums, bass, and various comp parts like piano, organ, strings, brass sections, or whatever is called for, all with MIDI controllers.

I make aftermarket style e-disks and Mrs. Notes and I both make aftermarket fake e-disks for Band-in-a-Box at http://www.nortonmusic.com

We have a steady, once-per-week afternoon gig at an oceanside resort, a twice a month outdoor gig at a huge RV resort, and various one-nighter gigs at yacht clubs, country clubs and active retirement communities.

Due to COVID we are only taking outdoor gigs right now, here are a few of the places we gig at.

Notes
 

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Look at all the cool pics.
I started a new thread for us and anyone else who wants to chat off topic.

 
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